I've been quite satisfied with the ISO 3200 images from my E-P1. And after a quick cleanup using Noiseware Standard, the result is better than ISO 400 images from many P&S... Any marginal improvements by the NEX would be nice, but not enough to doubt my investment in my PEN. 

Quote

after the 27 button pushes  it took to pull up iso 3200 on the nex

Are you serious?

He must be.  The reports that the NEX has a overcumbersome interface are greatly exaggerated.  I remember reading the reviews that said that it took 9 clicks to switch from photo to movie mode.  It takes me 2.  If I remember right, bringing up the ISO interface takes the same.

I attribute it to a generation gap.  Anyone who knows how to use a cell phone has no problems with the NEX.  My dad is still trying to figure out that whole mouse thing.

heres a quote from dp review

"The problems in the manual and semi-manual control modes come when you want to change anything other than the basic exposure settings - there aren't enough buttons to give direct access and there's no function menu to allow you to change them as you shoot.

The vast majority of cameras currently on the market have some kind of function menu that brings up a series of icons representing the camera's settings, allowing them to be selected and changed. It's not quite as fast as having direct access buttons but it's the next best thing. The NEX has no such option - changing the ISO, metering mode, AF area selection method or type of file being shot (which has implications for which features can be used), requires leaving the shooting mode and delving into the menu.

These settings are then scattered across three sub-categories (Camera, Image Size and Brightness/Color), which you have to scroll through each time, since the menu always resets to the top item on the list. So, assuming you last used the Brightness/Color menu, it still takes a minimum of 6 button presses to change the ISO setting, 8 to change metering mode and between 10 and 20 to configure and engage the HDR mode (the higher numbers coming if you were previously shooting RAW files).  "

i watched and waited nfor the rumors of sonys entry into the mirrorless  world, i wanted to love this camera , i wanted and imagined a sony version of the gf1,thats what i was dreaming of at least , with a back lit sensor and good high iso ability

instead sony disappointed me ,  im sure some will come to love it and its austere  fewer button ways and "different"  menu system, and will produce great shots with the nex`es

ill wait to see what they come up with nex-t ,     

Quote from: Panther on July 28, 2010, 03:01:57 AM

If you want me to believe that the PEN performs better than NEX at high ISO settings, then I'm going to have to disagree....Every review that has high ISO screenshots have clearly shown that the NEX series cameras perform better than the PENS at high ISO settings - these are quite easily seen in the screenshots that the reviews have provided.

So we'll just have to agree to disagree....

And now, I give everyone else the final word here....

And the same pictures at IR et al show that under less than high ISO, the PENs are sharper and have more detail.  So in the end, it's a wash.  The two sensors are equivalent.  The PEN sensor is sharper, the NEX sensor is better at ISO noise.  It's easy to deal with high ISO noise, use a flash.  It's not so easy to make your sensor sharper.  So arguably, the PEN sensor is better.  I feel like were in ground hog day, we just keep going over the same points over and over again.

Actually...the PEN sensor seems sharper because A.the lens is sharper and B.it uses a lighter AA filter and corrects via software. Also, flash IS NOT a way to deal with high ISO noise, it's not a way to deal with anything, it's actually an entire different area of photography. High ISO exist BECAUSE you cant use the flash, there's no available light or you need a higher shutter speed.

Quote from: cosinaphile on July 29, 2010, 07:29:23 PM

twas sarcasm  ,but  it has a counterintuitive and non photographer oriented interface

By the time you get to the ISO menu, changed ISO and shoot; I would've already shot, processed and printed mine with a PEN.

or any other slr for that matter...

Interesting that there's such a different opinion about the UI of the Sony NEX cameras. Anyways, I am curious as to what DXOMark tests on the sensor, since so many people use it.

To me it's kinda unfair, the NEX will get a better score in ISO because it goes all the way to 12800, but the doesn't mean it'll give you good quality at that ISO, or any other ISO for that matter, it just means it can go that high. More megapixels doesn't mean you'll have more line/pairs (as it should) but they count it as resolution. To me it's best to look at the actual pictures...

Yeah, I had noted the same thing in another thread. Who in their right mind would offer a fixed 24mm equiv lens on a consumer-oriented camera? Oh yeah, stuffed shirts who know nothing about photography....

I wonder how many Sony forums are filled with wails from newbies about big noses in their portraits and the lack of the "SLR look" (shallow depth of field) in their pictures!

I feel like I'm missing something here. Where is this 24mm coming from?

sony offer a lower priced option of the cheaper nex body with a 16 mm prime lens , which has a fov of about 24 mm equiv

a great lens for a photographer who wishes to be creative and a terrible burden for a newbie trying to take decent shots of family and friends as an
" only lens

many people only ever use the kit lens , can you imagine having  a camera for common use and only having an extreme wide angle???

I'm not gonna really post the other forum's address but there's a lot of frustrated newbies complaining about how their point and shoots where a lot better and more "versatile". When asked why, their answer was exactly what your saying. Wide angles are fun but you really need to know how to compose, what the hell was sony thinking?

Quote from: lisandra on August 06, 2010, 08:57:20 AM

Quote from: cosinaphile on August 05, 2010, 09:35:11 PM

sony offer a lower priced option of the cheaper nex body with a 16 mm prime lens , which has a fov of about 24 mm equiv

a great lens for a photographer who wishes to be creative and a terrible burden for a newbie trying to take decent shots of family and friends as an
" only lens

many people only ever use the kit lens , can you imagine having  a camera for common use and only having an extreme wide angle???

I'm not gonna really post the other forum's address but there's a lot of frustrated newbies complaining about how their point and shoots where a lot better and more "versatile". When asked why, their answer was exactly what your saying. Wide angles are fun but you really need to know how to compose, what the hell was sony thinking?

Heh, heh, heh.

I'd assume that the prime lens was Sony's way of saying "see, our cameras appeal to professionals too, we have a wide angle pancake lens to go with our NEX cameras!"

And then they have a wide angle adapter too, WTF?

They have some kind of wide angle adapter for the 24mm that screws on.

Anyways, let's get back to the topic about the sensor comparison.

One of the main problems that I have is that the sensors are not even the same size, so should we be even comparing them at all?

They have some kind of wide angle adapter for the 24mm that screws on.

Anyways, let's get back to the topic about the sensor comparison.

One of the main problems that I have is that the sensors are not even the same size, so should we be even comparing them at all?

yes because the main argument is that some people seem to think the nex sensor is leagues better than the PENs, and some of us dont think theres enough of a difference to say that,despite the size...

Quote from: voyager on August 07, 2010, 12:00:23 PM

They have some kind of wide angle adapter for the 24mm that screws on.

Anyways, let's get back to the topic about the sensor comparison.

One of the main problems that I have is that the sensors are not even the same size, so should we be even comparing them at all?

I think that at this point sensor design plays a much bigger role than sensor size, and processing comes second. Not even a full frame sensor is any good without a good processor (or raw converter). Just take a look at the mirror-less samsung, everything about it's picture quality sucks. Or look at how much the pentax Kx improved over the K7.

Funny you should mention that sensor in the K-x. I'm pretty sure it's the same one that's in the NEX cameras.