Author Topic: Olympus 17mm or Panasonic 20mm: Noob user. (Read 4300 times)

bibyfok · « **on:** September 04, 2010, 05:22:07 AM »

Hi all.

I just started photography, i have a e-PL1 with the standard zoom kit 14-42.
I was asking myself why, when you have the 14-42 f/3.5-5.6, buying the 17mm f/2.8 ? Is the light so different between f/2.8 and f/3.5? Has anyone some pictures showing the difference?

I have read a lot of reviews and people are always saying that the 20mm is -WAY- better than the 17mm. I cannot find anywhere pictures to see the difference. Also, as i would like to buy a new AF-friendly lens, to be able to get better "low light" shots, i was considering the Pana for it's f/1.7 however the price i really higher than the Olympus lens, does it really worst the price?

Any comparison pictures would be appreciated!!

Thank you

Yendi.

Panther · « **Reply #1 on:** September 04, 2010, 06:17:46 AM »

I'm convinced now that Olympus has difficulty making fast lenses.....The Panasonic is the fastest of the two....

javarob75 · « **Reply #2 on:** September 04, 2010, 09:12:26 AM »

I love my 17mm. Check out my other posts for some samples. Most of the shots of my son were taken in very low light (ISO 1600, f2.

.

lisandra · « **Reply #3 on:** September 04, 2010, 10:14:09 AM »

the panny is hands down sharper. It's the sharpest m4/3 out there

Toyuko · « **Reply #4 on:** September 04, 2010, 11:13:52 AM »

Panny 20mm

Ian Tindale · « **Reply #5 on:** September 04, 2010, 12:50:21 PM »

Having had both, Iâ€™m more in favour of the 17mm I now have. I think itâ€™s a superbly elegant lens, and in no significant way inferior to the 20mm.

bibyfok · « **Reply #6 on:** September 04, 2010, 02:48:32 PM »

Hi,

Thanks for your feedback!

Any chance to see a picture to get a better idea of the lens difference (low Light)?

Thanks.

Olof in Amsterdam · « **Reply #7 on:** September 04, 2010, 05:39:44 PM »

Here's one in low light. I focused on the microphone. Think the motion blur adds to the action.

<img src="http://e-p1.net/MGalleryItem.php?id=962" alt="" />

E-P1 Pana 20mm ISO 1250 1/20sec 1.7 raw converted in Lightroom

Olof in Amsterdam · « **Reply #8 on:** September 04, 2010, 05:44:33 PM »

Second try. I want the image in my post:

Details

Fine!

bibyfok · « **Reply #9 on:** September 04, 2010, 06:55:25 PM »

Maybe a stupid question but on your picture, is it possible to see the result if you were using the 14-40 kit? For example on photoshop by changing the curves? Cause i have really no idea what is the light difference between 1.7 and 3.5 oO

Your help is really appreciated!!!

cosinaphile · « **Reply #10 on:** September 04, 2010, 09:09:57 PM »

the kit zoom at 17 and the 17 mm , would look little different at the end of the day if both shots were correctly exposed and shot a shutter speeds that were sufficent for the shot , the faster prime is letting , im gonna say about slightly less that an extra stop of light, or slightly less than double the light,

where you will see a difference between what those two lenses would give you
is in sharpness at lower shutter speeds in available light as shutter speeds drop below 1\30 sec it becomes more difficult to ensure a crisp shot when your struggeling to hand hold at 1\15 sec or less , or shooting the motion of people any increase in lens speed becomes critically important to your' keeper" to "delete it" ratio

i think the 17 is a fine lens and its also smaller than the 20mm, in difficult lighting conditions the 20 will make a big difference in shutter speeds and get you more keepers, but the 17 mm is a 34 equiv , a focal length i like a little better than the 20

bibyfok · « **Reply #11 on:** September 04, 2010, 09:44:17 PM »

Hi

I would really like to thanks everyone on this thread.
I will try to explain my "problem", sorry if my english is not very good as i'm not a native english speaker.
I currently have the e-PL1 with the 14-42. I think I understand the concept of light as the lower the f/ number is, the more light the sensor will get.
So in my case i cannot get good shots in low light: almost all the time the AF can't catch anything so I MF. When im in low light and let say use the P program, my shot are noisy because the camera go higher in ISO almost all the time at 1600 ISO in auto ISO. I havnt tried A/S/M as i don't understand exactly the correct usage of these programs. So i tried to lower manually the ISO but no luck, all my shot get underexposed.
Using the flash is my last hope as i prefer to preserve the atmosphere of the scene.
I like wide angle lens as im almost always using my lens at 14 to 25mm, that's why i was thinking on getting a 17 or 20mm lens. I would invest in such lens only if it makes a really diference between my actual situation (high difficulties to get a good picture in low light) and a better situation where i would be able to get a "usable" shot (not to noisy).

Here is one good example of my problem:

Low ligh shot, 1600 iso, 1/13 speed:
Result is noisy with motion blur...

I would like to get a comparable picture, with a higher speed to stop the motion...

Will I be able to get this with the 20mm Panasonic?

Another time, thank to everyone for your help, but as im a student, invest such money in a lens is kind of a big deal for me. :'(

Olof in Amsterdam · « **Reply #12 on:** September 05, 2010, 03:14:13 AM »

Quote

Maybe a stupid question but on your picture, is it possible to see the result if you were using the 14-40 kit? For example on photoshop by changing the curves? Cause i have really no idea what is the light difference between 1.7 and 3.5 oO

At 1.7 you get four times more light on the sensor than at 3.5. So, with the kit lens you would have needed 1/5sec for the same shot.

cosinaphile · « **Reply #13 on:** September 05, 2010, 08:09:58 AM »

in would suggest your best choice would be a mf lens a 50mm f1.4 , people are
finding them for 10 -20 bucks and an adapter for the legacy lens you buy would be 25-30 dollars US on e bay,
then shoot on iso 400 or 640 or 800 and you will get sharper shots at night
night work with a kit zoom or even a 2.8 prime is practically impossible without a tripod , even then the motion of people is the problem you need to shoot 1\60 to 1\125 with the IBIS MANUALLY DIALED IN to get the results yoyu wish

remember 50 1.4 ..... iso 400-800... IBIS[STABILIZATION] ON FOR A 50 MM LENS

good luck with it

ratobuhler · « **Reply #14 on:** September 05, 2010, 12:14:22 PM »

A couple of examples. E-P2 with Panasonic 20/1.7

F2, 1/20 s, ISO 800, IS1 on, Hand held

F2, 1/6 s, ISO 800, IS1 on, Hand held

voyager · « **Reply #15 on:** September 05, 2010, 12:42:12 PM »

Quote from: bibyfok on September 04, 2010, 09:44:17 PM

Hi

I would really like to thanks everyone on this thread.
I will try to explain my "problem", sorry if my english is not very good as i'm not a native english speaker.
I currently have the e-PL1 with the 14-42. I think I understand the concept of light as the lower the f/ number is, the more light the sensor will get.
So in my case i cannot get good shots in low light: almost all the time the AF can't catch anything so I MF. When im in low light and let say use the P program, my shot are noisy because the camera go higher in ISO almost all the time at 1600 ISO in auto ISO. I havnt tried A/S/M as i don't understand exactly the correct usage of these programs. So i tried to lower manually the ISO but no luck, all my shot get underexposed.
Using the flash is my last hope as i prefer to preserve the atmosphere of the scene.
I like wide angle lens as im almost always using my lens at 14 to 25mm, that's why i was thinking on getting a 17 or 20mm lens. I would invest in such lens only if it makes a really diference between my actual situation (high difficulties to get a good picture in low light) and a better situation where i would be able to get a "usable" shot (not to noisy).

Here is one good example of my problem:

Low ligh shot, 1600 iso, 1/13 speed:
Result is noisy with motion blur...

I would like to get a comparable picture, with a higher speed to stop the motion...

Will I be able to get this with the 20mm Panasonic?

Another time, thank to everyone for your help, but as im a student, invest such money in a lens is kind of a big deal for me. :'(

At ISO 1600 at night you're going to get a lot more noise than you would in the day, that is unfortunately a limitation of pretty much any camera still. The motion blur is from 1/13th sec and the fact that you were holding the camera and your subjects were also moving, which is also unavoidable. The image stabilization doesn't correct for things that are moving, and it has it's own limitations. The photo you wanted to take probably would have worked with a shutter speed of 1/50 or higher, but you would have to raise the ISO to do that, leading to more noise.

bibyfok · « **Reply #16 on:** September 05, 2010, 09:47:01 PM »

Hi,

Another time, thank for all your feedback. Based on them, my next purchase will be the Panasonic 20mm. When i will have more money (Christmas ?) I will consider selling the 14-42 to buy a 14-150. I think with both lenses, my needs would be covered at 100%.
I will have a look at "cash converter" style shop to maybe find a bargain on a MF 1.4 lens and if i find something that would fit I will get a m4/3 adapter!

Ian Tindale · « **Reply #17 on:** September 06, 2010, 03:21:16 AM »

If you do it that way, it wonâ€™t focus as fast, because it wonâ€™t be designed specifically for contrast-detect focusing.

(Mind you, what is it about glass that makes it designed for or against contrast detect? Glass is glass, isnâ€™t it?)

MrPhotographer · « **Reply #18 on:** September 06, 2010, 03:43:21 AM »

Quote from: Ian Tindale on September 06, 2010, 03:21:16 AM

If you do it that way, it wonâ€™t focus as fast, because it wonâ€™t be designed specifically for contrast-detect focusing.

(Mind you, what is it about glass that makes it designed for or against contrast detect? Glass is glass, isnâ€™t it?)

Agreed. And for some people it's half empty, while for others it's half full

adash · « **Reply #19 on:** September 06, 2010, 03:55:59 AM »

Quote

If you do it that way, it wonâ€™t focus as fast, because it wonâ€™t be designed specifically for contrast-detect focusing.

If you're tailking about the MF 1.4 lens, that bibyfok mentioned above, I guess it is made for Manual Focus.

Quote

(Mind you, what is it about glass that makes it designed for or against contrast detect? Glass is glass, isnâ€™t it?)

Glass is glass, but AF motor and gears may behave differently. For example, you have probably noticed how your E-P1 moves the lens towards infinity, than back, than forward again, and all this in than a second. In a PD AF system, there is only one movement - from the current position to the new one.

Centauri27 · « **Reply #20 on:** September 07, 2010, 10:18:59 AM »

bibyfok, I can appreciate your situation. I went through exactly the same thing myself: got an E-P1 with the kit zoom, then agonized over which lens to get next. In the end, I ended up spending the extra $$$ for the Panasonic 20mm--I could not ignore the phenomenal reviews this lens was getting. Nobody had anything bad to say about it! Even seasoned pros were raving about it. After using this lens for a while, I would have to say it's worth it! (And I've already forgotten about the extra $$$ I had to spend.

)

As a student, I can appreciate that it's a big expenditure for you. Take your time and save up. This is a lens that will be with you for a long long time.

bibyfok · « **Reply #21 on:** September 07, 2010, 01:58:58 PM »

Haha, I hope so!

I manage to find a good deal. One of my roomate is looking for a nice m4/3 camera so we are going to buy a 20mm GF1 kit, and I will keep the 20mm. He will have the opportunity of trying the 20mm and the 14-42 on his GF1 and then make his decision on what to buy for him. i will get the 20mm at $370 and he will get his body for the same price which is good for both of us.

You will get news as soon as we get the gear

bibyfok · « **Reply #22 on:** September 07, 2010, 03:28:30 PM »

Just ordered the kit! Will be there in about a week

adri · « **Reply #23 on:** September 07, 2010, 10:41:29 PM »

I have the 20mm and it will be the lens that gets left on the body. It takes nice piccys!!

Adri

Author Topic: Olympus 17mm or Panasonic 20mm: Noob user. (Read 4300 times)

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